People with guns kill people

Guns don’t kill people, people kill people.

That’s what the pro-gun lobby says but people with guns kill people and some people with some guns can kill more people.

Tht is why the government has announced it will be toughening gun laws.

That is a good move.

I can think of no good reason why anyone but those in the military would need military-style weapons.

A law change should outlaw not just automatics but the accessories which can turn less dangerous fire arms into automatics.

The case against semi-automatics that can fire five or seven bullets at a time isn’t so clear cut.

They are used in pest destruction, not because those who use them are poor shots, but because they are the best way to get clean kills efficiently.

However, it ought to be possible to design a law that allows those who work in pest destruction to get the fire arms they need while prohibiting their possession or use for anyone else.


8 Responses to People with guns kill people

  1. Andrei says:

    I agree that there is no profound reason for an ordinary civillian to own an MSSA apart from small cock syndrome if you will pardon the profanity

    But we need to define things clearly before we legislate

    A farmer with a significant rabbit problem might well find a semi automatic rim fire 22 a useful too in culling his infestation

    On the other hand we had this bit of political theatre yesterday

    John Hart, who has been a sheep and beef farmer for 15 years, said he took his semi-automatic weapon into Masterton police station on Monday as he “couldn’t in all conscience” keep the rifle after seeing the loss of life in Christchurch.

    Firstly the story somehow fails to mention that John Hart was no. 12 on the Green Party List last election and I think that is relevant to the story

    Secondly the actual model of the firearm is blanked out in the image of the police receipt. However the caibre appears to be 762 a large centrefire calibre far more powerful than the humble 22 and totally inappropriate for pest control

    I suspect it is a ruger mini thirty – the ruger minis being more usually chambered for the smaller .223

    These used to be used, for deer culling from helicopters which makes sense I guess but not for a farmers pest control needs.

    You go through the same hoops if you want to buy a small bore single shot target rifle for the range as to buy an AR15 and that makes no sense what so ever to me


  2. homepaddock says:

    Thanks for the information about the firearm Andrei – yet again showing the importance of knowing all the facts.


  3. Andrei says:

    Off topic Ele but our old friend MacDoctor has run afoul of the thought police

    There have been at least two arrests of people denounced for saying things in the wake of the Mosque Massacre that are deemed unacceptable – though what was said will never be revealed

    I fear where we are headed but it seems very Stalinist to me


  4. Mr E says:

    The gun was a Saiga .762mm


  5. Murray Roxburgh says:

    I see no reason for anyone to own a bible or the Koran.
    I also see no need for anyone to own a Maserati or a Ferrari or a Porche.

    I own some very fine collectable weapons that are entirely legal and I really just enjoy the possession of them just as Swmbo has some fine bits of Jewellery that of very little use though she does carry them rather well.

    One of the first steps when Politicians wish to enhance their ever present desire to control the people is to disarm them so it seems that some of the convoluted desires of the little aussie cretin will succeed,
    Will the Crats and the Pollies sell ringside seats to their entry into Gang house number one and emerge without a single weapon beyond maybe a knife fork and spoon.
    Of course all the while ignoring that almost every Drug bust gathers up an accompanying collection of mostly illegal but very lethal weapons some well beyond anything permitted under even a Cat E licence.

    First they came for my guns.

    Do all those indulging in the knee jerk reaction seriously believe that a determined person will not be able to acquire a MSSA or even a still compliant under Cat “A” semi auto with extended Magazines should they harbour a desire to embark on a mission such as the small Aussie perpetrated last Friday.
    Should the baying mob have their way and assist the little cretin to succeed.

    Yes such a restriction on our ever diminishing freedoms come to pass it might make it harder but then there are many other options for mayhem available, planes, vans trucks boats?
    Do we seriously accept that this next nibble at responsible citizenship will prevent a deranged clever person from getting some semtex and a drone and attacking a stadium of concert goers or sports fans.

    Can we please have a detailed revelation as to how this foreigner came to get a NZ Cat A arms licence, what was the outcome of the vetting of the two persons who signed in support one who has a close living relationship and another who is well placed to opine as to fitness as a work colleague or similar, then there is the Crat who interviewed those two and signed off to the Arms Officer at a local Police station.
    A process I was involved in for some three years as a poorly recompensed minion that ended because I was in effect doing it for almost nothing and when I complained on matters of cost recovery was told to do more of the vetting of the independent referee over the freakin phone. That was where we parted as how in the hell would that work when the person at the end of the copper wire (Pun intended) could have been a graduate in communications who did not even know the applicant but had a degree that suggested the required support evidence was well worded.
    Oh and full disclosure of what really did happen when the alleged ex military man contacted Dunedin police over the Gun Club the murderer attended in the two years of planning, might also be revealing

    One more bit of useless but closely linked information, did not the CoL Police minister Nash not embark on a curtailment of the current system of vetting applications for new licences and renewals as an “Efficiency measure”. That seemed to me to be entirely at odds with what my personal experience suggested was already in serious need of more funding and strengthening as a process.

    Yes it will in all likelihood come to pass that law abiding citizens with impeccable records around compliance will have what might be regarded as simple rights curtailed but rest assured there will be serious non compliance even from some who until now have been law abiding and compliant.

    “Those willing to sacrifice Liberty for Security deserve neither”

    Yes very long comment sorry but needs saying, just saying

    I was as devastated and numbed as anyone at what unfolded on the ides of march, my total and uncomplicated sympathies and sorrow to all the victims, the deceased and those still living and dealing with the unmentionable horror of it all.


  6. Andrei says:

    The gun was a Saiga .762mm

    If that is true that is hilarious – whatever it shows how deceitful that man is.

    He had it for pest control, my ass


  7. Roger Barton says:

    John Hart is an affable fellow. I enjoy his company. Although I haven’t spent a lot of time with him.
    I get frustrated that he is depicted as a farmer as if it’s his life role. He has other means of income and indeed needs them as he farms little more than a large lifestyle block. The original muttering about his need for the 762 was that he might need for goat control. My gun cabinet includes two semi autos. One .22 plus a shotgun. Their primary use is pest control. We live in an area that was badly infested with rabbits some years ago. The Greater Wgtn Regional council can compel me to undertake pest control if the rabbit population exceeds a certain measure on the McLean scale. Don’t take my means of control away from me.


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