National working for and in the south #14

Fantastic Fact # 14:

9 Responses to National working for and in the south #14

  1. Dave Kennedy says:

    The $1 billion that the Greens propose to invest in R&D will save Invermay and bring us up to a similar level of research spending as other OECD countries. If we want to lead the world in innovation and high tech jobs it actually requires real investment. A low wage economy dependent on logs and milk powder is no real future. Our tax credits for private research will also remove the current bureaucracy for businesses from accessing funding.

  2. JC says:

    DK,

    The flaw in that argument is expressed in your very first sentence. Your immediate and first thought wasn’t research but political, ie, to save Invermay.

    More taxpayer money for research always follows the same pattern.. a political out come for groups and a plethora of accounting firms setting up seminars on how to get the typist and Cousin Bob on the research gravy train.. because its “free” money from someone else.

    J

  3. Dave Kennedy says:

    JC most farmers in Southland wouldn’t agree with you, Invermay was doing valuable research that had direct applications for the region. The people on the real Gravy train are the property investors who pay little tax, the businesses that earn income from subsidized carbon credits, the landlords who have incomes subsidized by state funds that artificially lifts the market values…

  4. Gravedodger says:

    @ DaveK, here we go again just like welfare, we will toss a billion dollars we dont have but we can easily remove from struggling mums and dads into a politically desirable container and see if we can benefit some wonky science that no one can employ or gain benefit from.
    What could possibly go wrong????

    Then again we could enact a legislative framework to encourage ‘the market’ to do it with an entrepreneur’s money and see if that works.
    Meanwhile Mr and Mrs Struggle-street can use more of the money they work for to benefit their children and lifestyle

    In your ‘money go round’ life, have you ever noticed private enterprise and the free market to deliver anything of value.

    You have absolutely no modicum of knowledge that every day somewhere a smart bugger is finding a better way to do something and more significantly they might be spending their own money they borrowed from a bank to do it after they have involuntarily donated money to a wally such as yourself to widdle it on a dunny wall.

    If “saving” Invermay is so financially sound and scientifically desirable then find some of the end users to put up the capital and then allow those risk takers to benefit but more than likely somewhere a farm animal breeder or a system developer will stumble on a good outcome and your beloved GP trogledyte mates will march on the Octagon to protest its implementation for some nefarious reason that escapes 98% of the population.

    Sheesh a billion here, a billion there and another billion somewhere else and you are talking real money.

    I fear Your sudden love of farm advancement through state funded R & D has much more to do with image than substance.

  5. Dave Kennedy says:

    Grave Dodger, this Government has supported state subsidized business more than most others. I would rather those subsidies went to research that supported one of our core industries than subsidizing:
    -Kidicorp, which also ripped of the Ministry by $1.6 million with false records.
    -Warner Bros by $60 million when our local film industry is producing good films but struggling (especially in Auckland).
    -$30 million to Rio Tinto
    -$30-50 million to oil companies in tax breaks and free seismic surveys
    -$1 billion in accommodation supplements for landlords.
    -$3-4 billion for Working for Families to subidise wages that fall beneath the living wage.
    -Carbon Credits will soon cost the tax payer up to a billion a year

    Government spending in things like education and R&D is an investment because it lifts productivity, supports high value goods and more skilled jobs. This in turn produces greater incomes and more Government revenue. This is smart economics. Dumb economics is continuing on the same highly subsidized support for industries that don’t need it and have minimal cost benefit ratios.

    The future is green according to many of New Zealand’s most successful business people: http://www.pureadvantage.org/blog/2012/06/11/new-zealands-position-in-the-green-race/

    I would rather deal with evidence and facts than ‘dunny’ talk 😉

  6. Southern says:

    National didn’t start housing supplements, that was Labour who also started working for families. And I believe it was Labour who also bought into the ridiculous carbon credit scheme that means we all pay more, but for naught, well not naught because I’m sure someone benefits, just not me, or the world for that matter.

    Try again Dave

  7. Dave Kennedy says:

    It doesn’t matter who started them (it wasn’t the Greens) and it is just evidence that there is a lot of subsidized funds going into the pockets of some with very little return. Money spent on R&D (and tax credits for private businesses) is just much smarter spending of public money.

    Southern, I note that you didn’t disagree with me because your argument seems to be that because Labour did it too it’s justifiable.

    The Greens carbon tax goes back to everyone and businesses as tax cuts, now that’s smart taxation!

  8. JC says:

    “The Greens carbon tax goes back to everyone and businesses as tax cuts, now that’s smart taxation!”

    And in British Columbia it means people and companies pay around 5-15% tax. Thats a long way from your “smart taxation” of 40% and a 1000 miles from ethical taxes.

    As for your disparagement of stuff like WFF thats economic orthodoxy throughout the Western world and agreed to by most mainstream economists. Basically it’s cheaper and less disruptive to pay subsidies like WFF than to introduce high minimum or living wages which kill entry level jobs and make countries uncompetitive.

    As it is our widely acknowledged high living costs are directly related to near the highest minimum wage in the OECD despite being one of the lowest paid per capita.

    Ideas like the living wage are designed to advantage those who have no children and mildly punish those *with* children.

    http://www.treasury.govt.nz/publications/informationreleases/livingwage/pdfs/lw-2726820.pdf

    JC

  9. TraceyS says:

    Southern – National did start the accommodation supplement and Labour’s WFF package increased the payments.

    Dave – I don’t see how the Green’s policies help people to pay market rents. The same issues will still exist under what they propose.

    The only reason the Green Party reckons it has all the answers is because it hasn’t had to deal with these difficult issues yet and probably never will.

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