Reasons not to vote Green

Guyon Espiner’s interview with Metiria Turei on Q&A  provided the following reasons not to vote Green:

1. The public transport mantra:

By investing in public transport for example, we not only build a comprehensive public transport system for all communities across the country, but we help to mitigate the impact of the importation of oil into this country. . .

Public transport isn’t necessarily the answers in cities and its definitely not the answer in small towns and rural areas.

2. The opposition to free trade:

Well our position is that you need to have systems of fair trade, that make sure that New Zealand can retain its economic sovereignty, and free trade deals tend to undermine the economic sovereignty.

The only fair trade is free trade.

Oh no, we are not extremists like some others might be, where free trade is the only option for New Zealand which tends to be the kind of ACT National kind of extreme.  We prefer a model that deals with these issues in a sensible rational way, making sure that New Zealand retains the highest level of economic sovereignty, to make the best decisions for its own people while being engaged with the global trade movement, which is very important, particularly when you’re dealing with under developed countries for example who need support.

The only sustainable support for developing countries is trade.

3. They won’t accept that a stock take of mineral resources on public land is sensible and that the economic and social benefits from mining land with low conservation values could be done without degrading the environment.

Now we don’t want the government, we’re very fearful that the government will rip out our national parks just to find coal and petrol, so we would like to make sure that the national parks and marine reserves and wetlands for example are kept free form threats of mining.

This view  is based on blind ignorance. No-one is suggesting ripping out national parks.

4. They overcharged on a flat rented by their MPs but owned by their super fund:

Earlier this year we did – those went out of whack, between February and March of 2009 one of the houses, MPs were claiming over the market value, we fixed that valuation in June to make sure they’re only being asked to pay under market value, and last week we refunded that over claim.  So we made a mistake and we fixed it.

They repaid the excess claimed – about $6000. But no mention was made of the fact they get more by renting from their super scheme than if they owned the flats themselves.

Kiwiblog has calculated that over the eight years they have owned the property they would have only been able to claim rent of $116,000 instead of $192,000.

5. Hypocrisy.

GUYON  . . . you have been telling other MPs and other political parties that you’re the moral compass of parliament, yet you’ve been ripping the taxpayer off.

The panel responding to this interview was political commentator Dr. Therese Arseneau, former National MP Paul East and former Labour president Mike Williams.

6 Responses to Reasons not to vote Green

  1. MacDoctor says:

    I only need two reasons not to vote green:

    1. Russell Norman

    2. Metiria Turei

  2. murrayg1 says:

    If you had investigated ANYTHING I’d commented on here, you wouldn’t be denigrating public transport – within 10 years, it is all we’ll have. You presumably read what I said about why kiwi rail.
    Free trade is what we have with Nigeria. Free trade is what we have with China. Neither are socially responsible, in the same way that sporting ties with a nation practicing Apartheid were not socially responsible. Fair trade is something entirely different, but ultimately both approaches are doomed so it’s a wasted debate. There ain’t the resources to go round.
    Actually, Brownlee would indeed rip into anything he could, the sad joke is that his fiscal world will have disintegrated round him, so all bets based on current realities are off.
    If we burn the coal without sequestration (let me guess, we’ll do research instead, anything to stave off actually forking out) our kids are in trouble. I don’t think it will get there – the world we know will be seriously dislocated by then. For instance, there is not the fuelled time left for the USA to climb out of her debt. That leaves a default situation, or a war situation. Neither are Business as Usual.
    What amazes me is the ‘this can’t be happening because I don’t want it to’ approach.
    It’s as if the designer of the Titanic was told: “yes Mr Andrews, we know you said that in an hour, two at the most, all of this will be at the bottom of the Atlantic. We’ve heard you, but please go away, we’re in the middle of an important discussion about how we can fit more deckchairs aft of the funnel.
    Turei will know very well why public transport is needed, and urgently. At this point, there is no time left to educate people, as demonstrated by the lack of impact my comments have had here. So she is left with pushing for what is needed, without wasting time and breath explaining why.
    Mark Twain put it something like this:
    ‘What gets us into trouble is not what we don’t know. It’s what we know for sure, that just ain’t so’.
    We have been run since 1984, by folk who know for sure, stuff that just ain’t so.
    And still are, obviously.

  3. homepaddock says:

    MacD – those two, too.

    Murray – “you wouldn’t be denigrating public transport” – it doesn’t work in small towns or the country.

  4. ZenTiger says:

    t doesn’t work in small towns or the country.

    Sometimes, it doesn’t work in the big towns either.

  5. ZenTiger says:

    It’s as if the designer of the Titanic was told: “yes Mr Andrews, we know you said that in an hour, two at the most, all of this will be at the bottom of the Atlantic. We’ve heard you, but please go away, we’re in the middle of an important discussion about how we can fit more deckchairs aft of the funnel.

    An interesting analogy. A lot of effort was put into the design of the Titanic. And a lot of cost. In the end, in spite of all the planning and cost, it sunk on its maiden voyage. They missed the “sideswipe an iceberg” scenario.

    Some of the suggestions on curing the economy by taxing carbon, by poor planning in general and by holding public transport up as the only solution to all problems reminds me of those designing the unsinkable Titanic.

  6. murrayg1 says:

    Um, in some ways you are right. Neither taxing carbon, nor trading it will work.
    The problem is that our species could not have sirvived in Carboniferous times, and won’t survive a rapid return to those conditions.
    All arguments, denials, duck-shoves etc, have to be seen in that light. Let’s call that the Titanic, eh?
    Now, does sequestration work? No, not outside the lab, and not with an EROEI better than 2:1. So that’s out, until and unless it gets better.
    What’s left? Trees. Ah yes….
    Mature forests are a zero-sum game, static bio-mass, just recycling itself. You can go backwards by removing the forest, but only maintain the ststus quo by keeping it. Sure, reward owners (government or private) for keeping the carbon locked up, but it’s no additional sink.
    Greenfields forest? Yep, that’s a win. Now you’re dealing with land-use competition (food or carbon, hmmmm) and what you do with the felled timber.
    Not nearly enough, sorry, and by a goodly margin – a deficit of unaddressable proportions then.
    So we have to reduce our emissions, and the only thing to reference is real ppm in the atmosphere – what else counts?
    Nobody says public transport is the WHOLE answer, and anyone can sideswipe POOR planning (without identification, it’s a bit like saying ‘good science’). NOBODY is suggesting ‘curing the economy by taxing carbon’, either. That is your take, from a pre-concieved mindset. Folk like me see the need to balance the planet’s chemistry as a requirement for our species. Nothing else. ‘The economy’ is a very recent, totally artificial construct, and if you think it more important than the habitat we require to survive, I feel sorry for you.
    A lot of planning and cost have gone into the fiscal world, too. They missed the ‘finite planet’ scenario. Hope they can swim.

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